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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 24, 2012 16:45:02 GMT -4
EBWOP:
Seriously though, a lynch is probably the best way to go forward this game. We've got 12 alive, 8 town, 5 anti-town. The odds of us firing into the darkness and hitting a scum is less than 50% (obviously otherwise we'd lose) but at this point in time is still quite good.
If two people die tonight we lose, simple as that. If not, we have one more day to strike it rich. Blade needs to pony up with logic on why CJ Gates is guilty if he really wants to help the town here.
Otherwise, someone needs to come forward with information.
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Post by jasonandrews on Jun 24, 2012 16:55:46 GMT -4
Has anyone else thought that the CJ vs Blade thing that they could both be scum trying to distract the town from a lynch?
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Post by Nathaniel Havok on Jun 24, 2012 17:12:53 GMT -4
This all seems a little... Iffy.
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Post by [ManiC] on Jun 24, 2012 17:30:45 GMT -4
Only idiots like their own posts. Mr. Callahan has got to be one of my favourite people on these forums... But to the matter at hand, I think it may be a bit far fetched to assume that CJ and Blade set up the debate in order to be a distraction as it seems it will inevitably end in a lynch, or even both being investigated. Both players are experienced so I doubt they'd be as rash and risqué as to try that. I don't really want a no-lynch to happen as that means we get no further, but a mis-lynch would be disastrous so we have to be careful on whose information we trust. Do we trust Blade's night action claims or do we trust CJ's pleas of innocence? I'm not familiar with how either player usually plays Mafia so I can't judge on that matter which makes it slightly more difficult for me to judge. If more information doesn't surface in time, I'm just going to count my chickens before they hatch and make a rash decision on how my vote goes. F.o.S. CJ & Blade (can I do that? It's not voting so I'd assume it's acceptable) |
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Post by Jules on Jun 24, 2012 18:53:22 GMT -4
Man, this game has stalled. On the face of it nothing has changed, but a few observations. -Bacon continues to be all over the place. First he wants to try and explain for Blade; then he's pointing the finger at Blade; now he's saying Blade and C.J. is a distraction. I don't know what he is up to, but he is either a jester trying to get himself lynched, a genius scum player pulling off the town fool to a tee in order to be ignored, or he is just playing really badly. -More bad maths. This time from Callahan. EBWOP: Seriously though, a lynch is probably the best way to go forward this game. We've got 12 alive, 8 town, 5 anti-town. The odds of us firing into the darkness and hitting a scum is less than 50% (obviously otherwise we'd lose) but at this point in time is still quite good. There is a certain certainty in tone in stating there are 8 town and 5 anti-town, which is 13, even though he says we've got 12 alive. Okay, maybe it's an honest mistake, and I'd probably just correct Callahan if it wasn't for that wishy-washy argument to try and force a lynch...even though Callahan is offering absolutely no information or thoughts about who we should lynch. This doesn't sit comfortably with me. Next... This all seems a little... Iffy. Can you be a bit more precise, Chaz, because comments like this are not in any way helpful. What posts or comments are 'iffy'? If we're going to go anywhere during this phase then we are going to need everyone contributing. This to me smacks of someone making an activity post, trying to convey they are making a statement or a contribution to the discussion, but are in fact saying nothing. * As it stands, we have no leads, but we have one contentious issue, i.e. Blade's voting for C.J., which has now been 'backed up' by Blade that he was involved in some kind of investigation and he got a night 1 'guilty' read from C.J. If it looks like a cat, then it's probably a cat, and this to me does smell a lot like bullshit. However, I don't want to, and I don't see it as necessary, to get into a back and forth with Blade about whether he is telling the truth. I think he's given us about as much info as he is going to, and really any discussion is going to come down to whether you believe him or not. I'm with Kris here in that my deeper worry is not so much that Blade is anti-town trying to force a mislynch on some bullshit info claim, but that he is working towards some rogue win-condition. If we're gonna use meta-reasoning, this gameplay is so un-Blade like. On that basis alone I'm right now weary of voting Blade until somebody can provide some further insight into him. (NB: I do still think the question of why the cop didn't check out C.J., just to be sure, stands and is a valid one - not fishing here, not looking for anyone to out themselves, but whoever the cop is that is something to think about. Had that been done we may be some way to actually solving this enigma.) So, that leaves C.J., if we're going down the line of we have to lynch someone and these two are our options (which seems to be the way we're going). If it was a toss-up between C.J. and Blade, on the premise that either lynch would provide info, I'd be inclined to lynch Blade because I'm just not buying his claim right now, but with my fears about Blade's possible rogue win-condition that's on the shelf for now. The question then, is whether it is worth lynching C.J. to gain info. If he flips town then we know Blade is probably anti-town, or some kind of rogue role like a jester, but we would still need further info to establish that before we could revenge lynch Blade, and we've mislynched a townie. If C.J. is lynched and flips some sort of anti-town role then we can say Blade is legit (even if he went about things oddly). I'm not sure, right now, if lynching C.J. is the right price to pay to find out so little about Blade. However, a mislynch today leaves us with nothing gained from this day (info-wise). So, on that basis I'm not voting for either C.J. or Blade, but I'm not implicitly backing the no lynch either. Based on what I said above, and the bad vibe I got from his recent post (and other bits of gameplay I've mentioned elsewhere) I'm going to vote: Callahan. I know I've gone around the houses to explain that, but I wanted to make it clear why I'm moving away from this whole C.J. v Blade thing (not saying it's a distraction, just saying I doesn't feel right to vote C.J. and have a bad vibe about voting Blade until we know more). |
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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 24, 2012 19:07:08 GMT -4
-More bad maths. This time from Callahan. EBWOP: Seriously though, a lynch is probably the best way to go forward this game. We've got 12 alive, 8 town, 5 anti-town. The odds of us firing into the darkness and hitting a scum is less than 50% (obviously otherwise we'd lose) but at this point in time is still quite good. There is a certain certainty in tone in stating there are 8 town and 5 anti-town, which is 13, even though he says we've got 12 alive. Okay, maybe it's an honest mistake, and I'd probably just correct Callahan if it wasn't for that wishy-washy argument to try and force a lynch...even though Callahan is offering absolutely no information or thoughts about who we should lynch. This is because I have no investigative role and thus no information relevant that I can offer you. Yes, my math was out. I checked my math again halfway through and forgot to correct the 12. It's not really a wishy-washy argument. It's a statement of fact. We have to lynch somebody right? We can't just stand by and let a No Lynch occur. All I'm pointing out is that our odds are good at this stage with only one scummer down. |
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Post by jasonandrews on Jun 24, 2012 19:22:57 GMT -4
Man, this game has stalled. On the face of it nothing has changed, but a few observations. -Bacon continues to be all over the place. First he wants to try and explain for Blade; then he's pointing the finger at Blade; now he's saying Blade and C.J. is a distraction. I don't know what he is up to, but he is either a jester trying to get himself lynched, a genius scum player pulling off the town fool to a tee in order to be ignored, or he is just playing really badly. I am just pointing out possiblities is all i am not defending him or anyone for that matter. I am just thinking up different possible reasons on why the way he is acting. Nothing more. But my question is why are you still questioning my motives? I am town plain and simple am i not aloud to give my thoughts of blades behavior? |
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Post by Jules on Jun 24, 2012 19:27:23 GMT -4
-More bad maths. This time from Callahan. There is a certain certainty in tone in stating there are 8 town and 5 anti-town, which is 13, even though he says we've got 12 alive. Okay, maybe it's an honest mistake, and I'd probably just correct Callahan if it wasn't for that wishy-washy argument to try and force a lynch...even though Callahan is offering absolutely no information or thoughts about who we should lynch. This is because I have no investigative role and thus no information relevant that I can offer you. Yes, my math was out. I checked my math again halfway through and forgot to correct the 12. It's not really a wishy-washy argument. It's a statement of fact. We have to lynch somebody right? We can't just stand by and let a No Lynch occur. All I'm pointing out is that our odds are good at this stage with only one scummer down. It's wishy-washy because you're saying we HAVE to lynch somebody, but you're not forthcoming with any info about who or why.. By 'info' I'm not just referring to night actions. What you think about what is going on in the game is 'info' too because it allows us to make opinions and judgements on you based on what you say or do. Right now, you want a lynch, but you're not willing to commit yourself to anything. I mean, what do you think about the whole C.J./Blade thing? This would be helpful to know. Right now it strikes me that you trying to push a lynch, but you're lurking in the shadows waiting for a bandwagon to get going so you can jump on it. Saying we need to lynch someone and saying who you think the best candidate for that is one thing, saying we need a lynch but adding nothing to that, just standing there saying 'someone needs to come forward with info' and/or waiting for a wagon to start moving is another. The latter is usually scum trying to fly under the radar. As it stands you have done nothing to change my mind that you are the scummiest player today. |
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Post by Jules on Jun 24, 2012 19:32:15 GMT -4
I am just pointing out possiblities is all i am not defending him or anyone for that matter. I am just thinking up different possible reasons on why the way he is acting. Nothing more. But my question is why are you still questioning my motives? I am town plain and simple am i not aloud to give my thoughts of blades behavior? I didn't say anything about you not being able to air your views on Blade, I'm just pointing out my observation that your play is contradictory and all over the place. I've not once said I think you are scum; in fact I'm pretty sure you're town. But I too am allowed to make my observations. |
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Post by jasonandrews on Jun 24, 2012 19:32:54 GMT -4
. Saying we need to lynch someone and saying who you think the best candidate for that is one thing, saying we need a lynch but adding nothing to that, just standing there saying 'someone needs to come forward with info' and/or waiting for a wagon to start moving is another. The latter is usually scum trying to fly under the radar. As it stands you have done nothing to change my mind that you are the scummiest player today. I agree all he has been doing is trying to blame other people instead of coming to a vote that makes sense. He has been doing this for quite a while now and god forbid i get bashed for doing this but. Vote: Crown JulesYou have down nothing to get this going instead of dragging this along a bit longer. |
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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 24, 2012 19:33:21 GMT -4
This is because I have no investigative role and thus no information relevant that I can offer you. Yes, my math was out. I checked my math again halfway through and forgot to correct the 12. It's not really a wishy-washy argument. It's a statement of fact. We have to lynch somebody right? We can't just stand by and let a No Lynch occur. All I'm pointing out is that our odds are good at this stage with only one scummer down. It's wishy-washy because you're saying we HAVE to lynch somebody, but you're not forthcoming with any info about who or why.. By 'info' I'm not just referring to night actions. What you think about what is going on in the game is 'info' too because it allows us to make opinions and judgements on you based on what you say or do. Right now, you want a lynch, but you're not willing to commit yourself to anything. I mean, what do you think about the whole C.J./Blade thing? This would be helpful to know. Right now it strikes me that you trying to push a lynch, but you're lurking in the shadows waiting for a bandwagon to get going so you can jump on it. Saying we need to lynch someone and saying who you think the best candidate for that is one thing, saying we need a lynch but adding nothing to that, just standing there saying 'someone needs to come forward with info' and/or waiting for a wagon to start moving is another. The latter is usually scum trying to fly under the radar. As it stands you have done nothing to change my mind that you are the scummiest player today. Well actually, my opinion of the whole CJ/Blade thing I already stated and that's that Blade needs to come forward with some more information before I can make a judgment. To expect me to make a blind call on the validity of Blade's word with no empirical evidence is a big ask and the fact you're pressing for something I've already addressed makes you look like you're grasping at straws. |
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Post by Jules on Jun 24, 2012 19:39:38 GMT -4
Well actually, my opinion of the whole CJ/Blade thing I already stated and that's that Blade needs to come forward with some more information before I can make a judgment. To expect me to make a blind call on the validity of Blade's word with no empirical evidence is a big ask and the fact you're pressing for something I've already addressed makes you look like you're grasping at straws. But Blade has come out with some info. He told us he was part of an investigation night 1 and that he got a guilty read from C.J. Is that not info? Also, what do you mean by 'empirical evidence'? I don't want a definition here, but I would like an example of what you would consider to be valid 'empirical evidence' in this case? Blade can't quote or show us his PM from the mod, if he did indeed receive this info, all we have is his word. That is the only evidence we have and are probably going to get, unless someone suddenly plucks some magical 'empirical evidence' out of their backside. This is nonsense Callahan, and you know it. You're trying to avoid my question with more wishy-washy rubbish. Tell me, what is your judgement about the truth of what Blade is saying? What do you think his motives might be? Do you think C.J. is a viable lynch as a means of providing some info about this matter? Because, sooner or later, you are going to have make a call on these issues, whether it be lynch one, the other, or opt for a no lynch. |
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Post by jasonandrews on Jun 24, 2012 19:40:34 GMT -4
EBWOP
Sorry i mis read the poster name just disregard that vote Unvote:Vote:Callahan
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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 24, 2012 19:50:38 GMT -4
Well actually, my opinion of the whole CJ/Blade thing I already stated and that's that Blade needs to come forward with some more information before I can make a judgment. To expect me to make a blind call on the validity of Blade's word with no empirical evidence is a big ask and the fact you're pressing for something I've already addressed makes you look like you're grasping at straws. But Blade has come out with some info. He told us he was part of an investigation night 1 and that he got a guilty read from C.J. Is that not info? Also, what do you mean by 'empirical evidence'? I don't want a definition here, but I would like an example of what you would consider to be valid 'empirical evidence' in this case? Blade can't quote or show us his PM from the mod, if he did indeed receive this info, all we have is his word. That is the only evidence we have and are probably going to get, unless someone suddenly plucks some magical 'empirical evidence' out of their backside. This is nonsense Callahan, and you know it. You're trying to avoid my question with more wishy-washy rubbish. Tell me, what is your judgement about the truth of what Blade is saying? What do you think his motives might be? Do you think C.J. is a viable lynch as a means of providing some info about this matter? Because, sooner or later, you are going to have make a call on these issues, whether it be lynch one, the other, or opt for a no lynch. You make me giggle, Jules. Really you do. You're asking me to repeat myself, aren't you? I haven't seen enough "empirical evidence" (y'know, something concrete) for me to justify voting for CJ Gates. Ergo, that's my stance on the Blade/Gates discussion. I don't feel with what evidence we have there's enough reason to justify putting a vote down on CJ Gates. That is my opinion. Until there's more on the table, my opinion will not be swayed. His initial post "Gates is scum. Trust me." just didn't sit right with me. The fact he expected people to blindly follow him over the chasm means that there's more to this than meets the eye. If he was investigating or "part" of an investigation on Night 1, why didn't he or someone else relevant for that matter check themselves for insanity? It doesn't make a lick of sense. Am I fence sitting? Absolutely. I've never had enough faith in my own judgments to try and take on leading the town and I'm not going to start. Not everybody plays like Level One or Kurt Noble or Keaton Saint. |
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Post by The Soul Of Philly on Jun 24, 2012 20:38:47 GMT -4
I need to work from 11 to 8 more often, I don't miss much.
Still we're trying to decide whether Blade's claim is worth following or not yet we get a few new items:
- Bacon continuing to be over-defensive about simple observations of his gameplay, continuing to say, "I'm town, plain and simple!"
- Jules vote on Callahan and his reasoning.
Gonna keep it short as I have to go to a grad party tonite but Bacon continually defending himself over observations of his gameplay has made me stop feeling his town, but he's still town, imo, for the time being.
Jules' vote is what intrigues me as I had a feeling that Callahan wasn't as clean as some thought, he was too quiet during day 2.
I just had this thought about the cop, I think I know who it could be, but i won't say who and I'll explain after this...
f.o.s: Callahan and Blade
Given what has transpired and my prior suspicion. I do understand why you are fence sitting, but I don't agree with it. At best, Blade is putting a self goal ahead of the team, the worst, he's scum trying to get the town to lynch one of it's own while getting the cop to step forward as a target.
That's why I'll kept my thoughts on who the cop is as not to even give the scum a choice of targets to pick from.
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Post by Kurt on Jun 24, 2012 23:10:29 GMT -4
Has anyone else thought that the CJ vs Blade thing that they could both be scum trying to distract the town from a lynch? No, because one is trying to lynch the other. Even if Blade and CJ are Mafia, one selling the other down the river doesn't exactly distract from a lynch; instead, it creates one. Even if it was originally a stall tactic for the Goodburn lynch, Blade had to have known this wasn't going away. Essentially, why create an issue that drew attention to both? EBWOP: Seriously though, a lynch is probably the best way to go forward this game. We've got 12 alive, 8 town, 5 anti-town. The odds of us firing into the darkness and hitting a scum is less than 50% (obviously otherwise we'd lose) but at this point in time is still quite good. If two people die tonight we lose, simple as that. If not, we have one more day to strike it rich. Blade needs to pony up with logic on why CJ Gates is guilty if he really wants to help the town here. Otherwise, someone needs to come forward with information. This is incorrect. Here's what you need to understand about this game: It is NOT over if he don't lynch today. If we lose a town, it's not over. If two people die tonight, it's not over. We would still sit at 6-5 without a lynch. Hell, even if we mislynch and go 5-5, game's not over. Scum and Third party have to eliminate one another to win, so the game will continue until one of the anti-town factions is dead and the town is in a minority. I understand the pressure, but this isn't lynch-lose territory. Jules pretty much sums it up. On the scenario of Blade/CJ...scum and third party will keep this going. It's a nice angle to play with...but I guarantee one is dead the second the other is. Why? If Blade is town and reveals CJ as Mafia, he's dead unless protected. If Blade is Mafia and leads to a CJ mislynch, I can't see the third party keeping him in play. If he is a jester pulling out leg, Mafia certainly won't let us lynch him first. So, I'm not incredibly worried like some of you...however... I'm gonna go ahead and ask something that I'm surprised no one else has asked. So Blade, you got CJ was guilty last night...what did you get last night? See what he says. Form your own judgment off of that. I know I will. |
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Post by C.J. Gates on Jun 25, 2012 0:41:42 GMT -4
First, I'm going to start by saying that I probably won't be on tomorrow. School and work dominating my time. So if you don't see me posting, it's because of that.
Now onto the game at hand...
So far, the only person who hasn't checked in is Calvin Ingram. I'm thinking that if he doesn't check in by 7, he may be mod killed...or at least, something along those lines. There was talk of a silencer being thrown around, but with Harvey's mod kill that kind of went out the window. The only reason why I bring this up, is because a mislynch today could lead to a potential two townies (depending who is lynched and if Calvin is mod killed and town) dying at the end of the day, and then more casualties at night.
Unfortunately, though, beyond the stuff between Blade and I (that seems to pop up EVERY game...) there isn't much to go on. Jules is trying to get stuff going with the game before it stalls out, but unfortunately, everything activity wise comes back to me and Blade.
I doubt I can say anything more to clear myself, so basically what I've said is all I can give. Blade is way off on his vote/investigation because I am not guilty. With no night action, all I can do, really is try to get some reads from people as to whether or not they are anti-town, but it's proving hard to do. The ones that look scummy are the ones that I have given the benefit of the doubt as being town (Bacon or Blade but I'm hesitant to vote Blade because of the already mentioned possibilities).
As for a possible vote....I'm torn. I don't want to throw a vote down that might hit a mis lynch, especially if Ingram is likely going to be mod killed. Last thing the town needs is to lose a possible 3 players (not saying we will, but it's a possibility).
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Post by Nathaniel Havok on Jun 25, 2012 2:23:48 GMT -4
This all seems a little... Iffy. Can you be a bit more precise, Chaz, because comments like this are not in any way helpful. What posts or comments are 'iffy'? If we're going to go anywhere during this phase then we are going to need everyone contributing. Sure thing. I'm talking about this... This Blade Vs Cj thing is clearly a distraction. We need to start getting votes in for a lynch soon or we will possibly lose another town. And then, there's stuff like this... That immediately turns into this... EBWOP Sorry i mis read the poster name just disregard that vote Unvote:Vote:CallahanAm I missing something? I mean sure, he could have made that mistake... But have we ACTUALLY confirmed 100% that he's town? If so, this has to be the most god-awful way to play. I have to say... The way some people play this game absolutely drives me crazy. And yes, my post earlier was to let everyone know I am still around. I just wasn't home all day, and wanted to stay active. I spent the day with my family. |
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Post by jasonandrews on Jun 25, 2012 2:32:34 GMT -4
I am sorry chaz i am still new to playing this game this is only my third overall game two on cwc and one here
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Post by Nathaniel Havok on Jun 25, 2012 2:36:22 GMT -4
I don't mean to sound like an ass, Bacon. I never have. I just... Am one. My bad.
My issues with you stem from your approach to what I said in the beginning of the game. You insisted that I "didn't want any activity", when I said NOTHING of the sort. You might have misunderstood me, but I don't know how I could have made it any clearer.
I've been through the entire thread, but I can't seem to find where you were undoubtedly 100% cleared as town. If you can find this for me, my opinion will change, and I'll immediately look elsewhere. But until then, I just can't buy the "I'm new" gimmick. It's been played before, and townees have died because of it, you know?
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Post by Jules on Jun 25, 2012 4:50:24 GMT -4
You make me giggle, Jules. Really you do. You're asking me to repeat myself, aren't you? I haven't seen enough "empirical evidence" (y'know, something concrete) for me to justify voting for CJ Gates. Ergo, that's my stance on the Blade/Gates discussion. I don't feel with what evidence we have there's enough reason to justify putting a vote down on CJ Gates. That is my opinion. Until there's more on the table, my opinion will not be swayed. His initial post "Gates is scum. Trust me." just didn't sit right with me. The fact he expected people to blindly follow him over the chasm means that there's more to this than meets the eye. If he was investigating or "part" of an investigation on Night 1, why didn't he or someone else relevant for that matter check themselves for insanity? It doesn't make a lick of sense. Am I fence sitting? Absolutely. I've never had enough faith in my own judgments to try and take on leading the town and I'm not going to start. Not everybody plays like Level One or Kurt Noble or Keaton Saint. Oh look, more waffle interlaced with words like 'ergo' to make it seem like you're actually saying something. You still haven't addressed any of my questions. You merely re-stated your desire for 'empirical evidence', provided a definition which I don't need, yet failed to provide any example of what would constitute 'something concrete'. You've admitted your fence sitting, so that's something I guess, although you haven't given a full account of what you think about C.J./Blade so you hardly have to fear repeating yourself. Anyway, in the interests of clarity it might be judicious to repeat yourself in case I've either missed something or I am just not getting it. Lastly, you don't trust your own judgements? Then, pray, do tell why you're playing the game? Don't take this as a personal attack but someone saying they don't trust their judgements doesn't wash for me in the game where it's all about making judgements. You don't trust Blade's info, and since I really doubt Blade is giving us anything else, does this mean you're voting Blade? Are you worried about the possibility that he is a Jester? Could lynching C.J. be a good option as a means of providing some info? Since it looks like we're heading down the root of no lynch, does this concern you? If so, are you going to do something to try and force the town's hand one way or another? These are all questions that need answering (by everyone), but which you are conveniently (or inconveniently depending on how you look at it) avoiding. |
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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 25, 2012 7:20:56 GMT -4
You don't trust Blade's info, and since I really doubt Blade is giving us anything else, does this mean you're voting Blade? No, it doesn't. It just means I'm not convinced by it. Are you worried about the possibility that he is a Jester? Not at all. Jeff is a good mod and no good mod would put a jester role in their game. Could lynching C.J. be a good option as a means of providing some info? Well, yeah. I guess so. I mean if we do then we find out either that; A) Blade is a fuckin' liar. B) His investigative info was a bunch of bullcrap. C) Someone should've checked their insanity before making accusations. That said though, I'm not getting scum vibes. Since it looks like we're heading down the root of no lynch, does this concern you? If so, are you going to do something to try and force the town's hand one way or another? No. I have no information and frankly, no idea about who could be scum. You to me look the worst right now because you're trying your best to point out my fictional evasiveness in order to make me look like a good scum candidate. Granted I've not been the most helpful player in the game, but again, you seem to be mistaking me for the likes of Sally Talfourd and Kurt Noble. These are all questions that need answering (by everyone), but which you are conveniently (or inconveniently depending on how you look at it) avoiding. I'm not avoiding any of your questions. You're majorly overstretching and looking for anything you can to try and get people to vote against me. |
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Post by Jules on Jun 25, 2012 8:38:58 GMT -4
Here's the thing Callahan.
Earlier in the phase you said we have to lynch somebody, which is false. That is misinformation, usually a tactic used by a scum player to make the town paranoid and rush into any sort of lynch (and from the scum's pov a mislynch). Kurt did a great bit of analysis on this so I refer you back to that if you're still unsure.
Now, you're saying that you're not convinced by a lynch. You keep making this appeal to 'empirical evidence' and for someone to come forth with some info, the lack of which urges you to be cautious.
This second paragraph (the reasoning it outlines) is fine in its own right, but is completely contradictory to the notion in the first - that we must lynch someone.
If all you wanted to say is we need to be looking to lynch scum, well then you're just stating the obvious and not contributing anything to the game, just sitting in the background waiting for somebody else to either do the work for you, or for some bandwagon to get going so you can jump on it.
In short, you've gone from being pro-lynch to now stalling the advancement of this day phase.
Next, you say that you don't believe Blade's info, but you still haven't explain what would count as the 'empirical evidence' that would force you to believe it - are you talking here about some kind of corroborative evidence from another player? If so, that's all you had to say instead of putting out this empty concept as if it makes out you are acting prudently. (I hate to give you suggested explanations, but you're being so belligerent in refusing to make this clear I'm forced to.)
Now, if you don't buy Blade's info you either think a) he is lying, or b) he may be telling the truth, but there isn't enough certainty behind what he says to convince you.
If you think a) well then how can you not be getting scum vibes? If you think some is lying, or bullshitting, or being deflective, then how could you not question their motives? All of the former are scumtells, so if you think someone is lying you usually think they are scum. Hence, if you think a) your mind should be made up about voting.
However, if you're leaning towards b) then what options do we have? i. act on the info to discover its veracity; ii. wait out for further info. Regards ii. we've done enough waiting, I really doubt any more info is coming. Ingram is the only person I imagine is going to provide this, since he is the only one who hasn't checked in, but since he has been AWOL for days I highly doubt that will happen. So that leaves i. you act. You either go with lynching C.J. in order to discover whether Blade is telling the truth, or you go with a no lynch in the hope that the night sheds further light on it.
Judging by your last post, I see you're leaning towards a no lynch. That's fine, if you see the vote as split between C.J. and Blade and think neither are viable lynches, then we're at least in agreement.
But why couldn't you just say that to begin with instead of spending 4-5 posts making wishy-washy statements that avoid questions, or OMGUS comments that try to deflect people's attention on to me.
I've haven't fabricated a single thing, I've just pointed out my observations about some of your contradictory posts/behaviour and your evasiveness, which far from 'overstretching' should be clear as a Swiss lake to anyone.
Btw, I still think you are scum so my vote stands.
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Post by Michael Callahan on Jun 25, 2012 9:06:35 GMT -4
Here's the thing Callahan. Earlier in the phase you said we have to lynch somebody, which is false. That is misinformation, usually a tactic used by a scum player to make the town paranoid and rush into any sort of lynch (and from the scum's pov a mislynch). Kurt did a great bit of analysis on this so I refer you back to that if you're still unsure. Maths fail. I agree that a further No Lynch is the way to go. Now, you're saying that you're not convinced by a lynch. You keep making this appeal to 'empirical evidence' and for someone to come forth with some info, the lack of which urges you to be cautious. This second paragraph (the reasoning it outlines) is fine in its own right, but is completely contradictory to the notion in the first - that we must lynch someone. If my previous maths had been correct then yes, it would've been important to lynch someone. I still think it is (although like I said, leaning back towards the No Lynch). I'm just not convinced yet on either CJ Gates or Blade. "If we don't do it, we lose" was an exaggeration sure, but it's going that way. We don't want to lose anymore ground when there's still five anti-town players out there. If all you wanted to say is we need to be looking to lynch scum, well then you're just stating the obvious and not contributing anything to the game, just sitting in the background waiting for somebody else to either do the work for you, or for some bandwagon to get going so you can jump on it. In short, you've gone from being pro-lynch to now stalling the advancement of this day phase. No, you have by asking me questions which I go on to answer which leads to you accusing me of ducking them. Next, you say that you don't believe Blade's info, but you still haven't explain what would count as the 'empirical evidence' that would force you to believe it - are you talking here about some kind of corroborative evidence from another player? If so, that's all you had to say instead of putting out this empty concept as if it makes out you are acting prudently. (I hate to give you suggested explanations, but you're being so belligerent in refusing to make this clear I'm forced to.) Another source would be nice. Some more explanation from Blade or the person he conducted this lynch with, answers to my questions about why the person related didn't check their own insanity Night 1, all that junk. It's not rocket science, Jules. Now, if you don't buy Blade's info you either think a) he is lying, or b) he may be telling the truth, but there isn't enough certainty behind what he says to convince you. If you think a) well then how can you not be getting scum vibes? If you think some is lying, or bullshitting, or being deflective, then how could you not question their motives? All of the former are scumtells, so if you think someone is lying you usually think they are scum. Hence, if you think a) your mind should be made up about voting. Because I'm not convinced enough either way that I want to vote on the scenario? However, if you're leaning towards b) then what options do we have? i. act on the info to discover its veracity; ii. wait out for further info. Regards ii. we've done enough waiting, I really doubt any more info is coming. Ingram is the only person I imagine is going to provide this, since he is the only one who hasn't checked in, but since he has been AWOL for days I highly doubt that will happen. So that leaves i. you act. You either go with lynching C.J. in order to discover whether Blade is telling the truth, or you go with a no lynch in the hope that the night sheds further light on it. Judging by your last post, I see you're leaning towards a no lynch. That's fine, if you see the vote as split between C.J. and Blade and think neither are viable lynches, then we're at least in agreement. But why couldn't you just say that to begin with instead of spending 4-5 posts making wishy-washy statements that avoid questions, or OMGUS comments that try to deflect people's attention on to me. I've haven't fabricated a single thing, I've just pointed out my observations about some of your contradictory posts/behaviour and your evasiveness, which far from 'overstretching' should be clear as a Swiss lake to anyone. Btw, I still think you are scum so my vote stands. Stop telling me that I'm avoiding your questions simply because you're not satisfied with the answers. There are no questions I've shied away from. I've confronted every point you've made and answered open and honestly with due course. If you want to vote me, that's fine. That's your mistake. Not mine. I just hope that other people see sense and don't decide to jump on your bandwagon. |
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Post by Blade on Jun 25, 2012 12:35:34 GMT -4
I am confused because people are asking me to formulate some amazing speech in order to nail CJ to rights.
I investigated CJ night one and got a guilty.
How can I formulate a speech around that that is any different to what I am saying?
I am not a cop. I can do different things but only once. Last night I had to do something different. Damn this BRAIN of mine
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Post by Kurt on Jun 25, 2012 12:40:49 GMT -4
I am confused because people are asking me to formulate some amazing speech in order to nail CJ to rights. I investigated CJ night one and got a guilty. How can I formulate a speech around that that is any different to what I am saying? I am not a cop. I can do different things but only once. Last night I had to do something different. Damn this BRAIN of mine I'm not asking you to formulate a speech or do anything fancy. I've made that clear already. I did ask what you did last night though. If you really want the town to consider your proposal, this is what you have to give. |
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Post by [ManiC] on Jun 25, 2012 12:47:26 GMT -4
So Blade isn't the cop? Possibly JOAT if he has multiple one-shot abilities? Anyway, I'm assuming if a lynch doesn't go ahead (and it seems one won't) then whoever is the cop will go ahead and either follow Blade's lead and investigate CJ and thusly prove or disprove Blade's investigation or they will investigate Blade to see whether or not he's to be trusted (i.e. town or not town). I'd probably investigate CJ just in case Blade is town and merely got a mis-reading (since if Blade comes up town, the consequences will likely mean a potentially innocent CJ gets lynched, though this may work both ways). I can see where Jules is coming from, but I'm not getting a scum reading on Callahan, but that may be because I'm not too sure on what I'm looking for, so I'm not going to follow down that route.
For now my F.o.S. still stands as it is.
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Post by [ManiC] on Jun 25, 2012 12:48:19 GMT -4
If you want to vote me, that's fine. That's your mistake. Not mine. I just hope that other people see sense and don't decide to jump on your bandwagon. Callahan doesn't want someone's vote? What is this?! |
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Post by Blade on Jun 25, 2012 13:04:07 GMT -4
I am confused because people are asking me to formulate some amazing speech in order to nail CJ to rights. I investigated CJ night one and got a guilty. How can I formulate a speech around that that is any different to what I am saying? I am not a cop. I can do different things but only once. Last night I had to do something different. Damn this BRAIN of mine I'm not asking you to formulate a speech or do anything fancy. I've made that clear already. I did ask what you did last night though. If you really want the town to consider your proposal, this is what you have to give. I used my action on CJ. He did not go anywhere. So at least I can rule out that he is the hitman |
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Post by Blade on Jun 25, 2012 13:05:14 GMT -4
At least that is the response I got from Jeff.
If I had a kill option, trust me I would have used that by now
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![[ManiC] Avatar](http://i1242.photobucket.com/albums/gg528/ManiCGFX/GayBar.gif)
